Saturday, June 27, 2009

whatever

Some of you may have stumbled across this on Daniela's blog..

Since the usual pattern that I’ve seen with these sort of things (ie anytime anyone dares to disagree or criticize anything that CJ Laity seems to do) typically ends with him twisting you’ve everything said around to suit his own purposes and make himself out to be the victim(SEE COMMENTS BELOW),
I initially refrained from responding to his little jab about my weight. It seemed so puerile, so junior high, and, hell, sort of sad and pathetic that all he could think to level at me was a criticism about my appearance. Not to mention sort of ineffective if he intended to be hurtful, since I pretty much got over any sort of body issues in my early twenties, and having decided that, indeed, since I am a girl who likes to eat, to accept my body whatever it’s size, shape, etc. So being overweight, not really an issue for me. So it was pretty laughable to find that that’s what the argument had been reduced to. Really, almost not any more worth of a response than a wild-eyed ranting man on the corner yelling at everyone as they pass by who calls me a bitch because I won’t give him a dollar. What my body weight has to do with poetry or the calendar blog, I just don’t get… And seriously, wow, who knew as a "young overweight woman" I had so much power to put down "the older man"...perhaps I should add that to our mission statement..


He seems somehow to think that there is this vast conspiracy against him, but, really, I have my own distinct reasons for wanting to avoid him (see here and here). Note: his comments have conveniently been deleted, but you can see some of the tone of it if you follow the initial Time Out Chicago Blog link.) Seriously, no one told me he was a bully because I saw it for myself, several times. Numerous times,actually, and with more people than I can count. This imaginary vast conspiracy? I’m sure everyone, no matter which crowd you hang out with in Chicago, probably has something to say about their bad interactions with him. But I tend to form my own opinions about people regardless of what others say. If he wants to continue to think everyone is out to get him, that’s his choice. Mostly I think everyone just tries to ignore him and go about their business. But sometimes, it’s hard to ignore the hatred masked as “news”. My biggest problem with his site, is the negativity he seems to propagate and thrive on, which was my impetus in thinking maybe there was another way, a better less hate filled way to get poetry news out locally. After seeing him rip people apart during that Small Press Month tirade, again and again, I wanted something infinitely less negative, more open to varying view points, to all different little corners of the Chi Po world, which I thought a group blog would do. It’s not really my blog any more than it is anyone else’s on the contributors list, or anyone else who wants to contribute for that matter. An alternative to the maliciousness, the bullshit, the gossip. I sent invitations to join to every single contact in my address book that edited a journal, ran a press, or a litmag, or would have news of some sort, and the people who joined were the ones who responded. His claim on the phrase “chicago poetry” is absolutely ridiculous . What else is one going to a calendar blog that lists readings and such. The Topeka Poetry Daily. ? But it’s what can be expected I suppose from someone who seems to think he has ownership of "chicago poetry". I also don’t get how it seems that I’m copying or stealing from him when the layout and format of the sites are entirely different, the general tone entirely different (we don’t really feel the need to insult the people whose events we are listing, grandstand, or otherwise be a petty and childish.) And believe me, the blog is hardly trying to benefit from his “fame” in fact, I think it would probably like to get as far away that sort of “fame” as possible.

I’m also not sure how I managed to push out other people from the Small Press Showcase, since I had absolutely nothing to do with the planning besides saying “yes” when asked to be a part of it. Did I call him crazy? Yes, apparently I did... I really have no idea whether he actually is, in the rest of his life certifiably insane or not (only those close to him can testify to that. I do not know him well enough to say ) When you are maliciously bashing people at every turn, have delusions of grandeur about being the sole voice and possessor of “chicago poetry”, and spend all your time thinking up ways to rile people up. Yes, that is CRAZY. There is no excuse for it.

Anyhow, I just wanted to chime in my 2 cents and thank all the bloggers that have offered their take on this…There is an interesting discussion in there somewhere on how the female body becomes fodder for discussion in a way that a male’s never does..sadly, I think we’re barking up the wrong tree however if we’re in want of rational discourse with this one..

In the end, he can crack fat jokes till he's blue in the face...the logical solution is to just ignore him til he redirects his rage against the next person on his little list, the next person who disagrees or looks at him funny.

But now that I think about it, the more we talk about it, the more he gets to make an ass of himself in public..so really it's a win/win.
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21 comments:

becca said...

Kristy -- I really appreciate hearing your thoughts on this issue. I agree that our speaking up has only caused him to look meaner and smaller via the comment box dialogues. It's also worth noting that not a single person has come forth to defend what he did; instead, every person who decides to comment shows him/herself to be reasonable and just.

In your explanation of your Chicago Poetry Calendar site, you note, importantly, that there are MANY poetry scenes in Chicago. Of course there are -- it's the third largest city in the country! -- but CJ doesn't seem to see this, and is treating "Chicago Poetry" as some kind of monolith.

So, I want to thank you, in the midst of all this, for caring about communities instead of claiming ownership over them!

So sorry you have to deal with this. We all know the fantastic work you do for Chicago and U.S. poetry.

Rebecca said...

Awesome. I've been reading through the blogs of your fellow poets on this subject and it's great how supportive, rational and intelligent all responses have been. It really makes me happy and even more proud of you. Since I'm not exactly unbiased and I am neither a poet, nor part of any "scene" and not even living in the Chicago area these days, I feel as if I can be as irrational as I want to be without being directly affected by any venom spewed forth by others on the internets.

FUCK YOU CJ! LEAVE MY SISTER ALONE!
And your "poetry" sucks too.

Merry Gangemi said...

Hello Kristy,

Your mindfulness in the face of CJ's rampage is deeply appreciated and admired. The implications of his behavior are not encouraging but you have certainly put him in perspective!

Jason said...

You know, it seems to be true that there is drama in every community. Unfortunate, but true. Even so...my lord. This CJ character is just a jackass. Setting aside the calendar issue (Aside - y'know...if it's important to you to have "The" calendar of events for "The" Chicago poetry scene, then the right approach is probably not to whine about the title or URL of the thing, as that makes one look like an idiot. End of aside.)....

Um, where was I? Right, CJ just seems to be a tool. Dealing with tools is no fun at all, and I'm sorry you've had to waste so much time dealing with that one.

chicagopoetry said...

Whatever yourself, Kristy, all your BS would be more convincing if you weren't blatantly piggybacking off my domain name in order to try to steal my audience. Develop your own audience! In March of 2008 you also bashed me at your blog while at the same time registering a "chicagopoetry" domain name. What was that all about? You pretty much made fun of the mentally ill and I don't recall ever hearing an apology from you, so as far as I'm concerned, I'm way ahead of you in the diplomacy department. In those posts last year you admitted you wouldn't even have met many of the people who helped you in your career if not for me, so how do you justify how you continually villify me? Isn't it true you just want to push me out of the picture so that I don't introduce other young women to important people, women who perhaps might compete with you for the prizes and publications you bid for? Is that how you have come this far? By cheating and stealing? You give feminism a bad name with your thievery. The way you behave it is no wonder so many people say derogatory things about you. You are part of a tiny, insignificant clique that won't even be here five years from now, so enjoy it all while it lasts.

kristy bowen said...

same shit, different day..

chicagopoetry said...

Yeah, and same shit from you. I'm sick and tired of every time I complain about your total shit you call my sanity into question. If it is so okay for someone to steal someone else's domain name just because she doesn't like what he's doing with it, then welcome to wickedalicecalendar.blogspot.com

Fair is fair!

kristy bowen said...

*rolls eyes*

Obviously I was wrong...you're not crazy at all...

chicagopoetry said...

Yeah we'll see if your rolling your eyes when the search engines pick it up and people who are looking for you come to me instead. And, see, you just made fun of the mentally ill again. You are childish, Bowen. Grow up.

Evildolleyes said...

You know, Kristy, he may have a point. The mentally ill might be offended by their implied association with this clown. >;)

chicagopoetry said...

. . .and you hang out with a bunch of losers, really. You guys think you are so smart but look at your own posts. The most intelligent thing you guys can come up with is "your poetry sucks" or some other lame insult. It's like I'm dealing with Romper Room here, which is surprising, because Bowen is suppose to be this big shot poet, yet every one her friends who have posted have spouted ugliness that would put anything I've ever said at chicagopoetry.com to shame. All of you guys need to look in the mirrors. You are stealing from people! Stop it. My right to the domain name Chicago Poetry is not up for discussion. That domain name is already taken, it has been taken for ten years. YOU CAN'T HAVE IT. And you continue to make fun of the mentally handicapped while protesting comments made about someone's weight. You continue to badmouth someone even after he's apologized. Man, you guys make my stomach churn. Trying to communicate with you guys on any type of civil or intelligent level is like trying to communicate with a bunch of children.

kristy bowen said...

as I said in the post, I have no idea about your mental instability, but your behavior is truly indicative of a ranting lunatic...

chicagopoetry said...

Kristy Bowen, it is YOUR behavior that is indicative of a lunatic. You came to Chicago, used me to meet the people you wanted to meet, then you stabbed me in the back and now you're trying to take my place as the publisher of Chicago's poetry calendar. Now you are saying if a poet "rants" he's a lunatic. A poet? Can't rant! Get the hell out of Chicago and go back to whatever backward world you came from!

kristy bowen said...

oh hell, you're on to me..that was step one of my plan for world domination...:)

chicagopoetry said...

Yeah, use your sarcasm to escape actually having to deal with the issues put in front of you. That always works for you, Bowen, doesn't it. Whenever someone confronts you with your own behavior, just spout some sarcasm. Textbook Bowen!

Evildolleyes said...

What sarcasm? She still has to get past me and I have hair-pulling robots programmed for the chick fight, so I win. :)

chicagopoetry said...

Furthermore, Bowen, you are USING all your friends to fight your battle for you, when you know damn well they don't have the time or ability to actually go back and learn the true history of it all. You incite them by telling them that I'm just some paranoid lunatic and they believe you and they go ahead and spout the venom at someone that they've never even met, all based upon your lies. What's worse is that you hurt me personally. Yes, I reviewed your book because I was a FAN of Kristy Bowen. I sat there at the Juried Reading and I cheered for you when you won. We had some little disagreement about some lousy $20 I asked for one year during a poetry fest. So what? I didn't hold that against you. Then all of a sudden last year during the Month of March you told me how much you hated me and you've been at me ever since, now even stealing my domain name. You make me afraid to promote small presses in Chicago out of fear I'll end up promoting another Kristy Bowen, who is going to turn around and use the support I offer against me. You make me afraid to review small press books because you've acted so amateur. And now you USE your friends, inciting them against me, for what purpose, to what end?

kristy bowen said...

As I see it, there is no issue. And really this is getting sort of tiresome...

chicagopoetry said...

Typical, ignorant, Kristy Bowen non-response. Of course there is an issue. The issue of why you are piggybacking off my domain name, for one. But, yes, it is tiresome trying to get through your brick wall of a head, so let's leave it at that.

Leanne said...

Wow, I'm so sorry that you have to deal with all of this stress.

Dancing Girl Press and all of your effort in literature in art seem valiant. I've been reading your blog for quite some time and it has inspired me to believe that I can start a micro press here in Canada.

I feel sorry for this guy - too bad he's too uninformed to know that a blog name is not a domain name and that when artists co-operate and support each other everyone wins. Wow, to think of all the poetry he's not writing expending all of that hateful energy.

Ultimately, you get what you give right?

Take care Kristy. Good for you for sticking up for yourself.

crazyuddie said...

I think the fact really is that no one (repeat NO ONE) has the rights over the name Chicago Poetry (those words in any possible or conceivable combination). It doesn't belong to anyone. So any one has the right to use those.

Our wish (as Chicago poets and Chicago citizens) is that whoever is running the particular domain do a good job of it. (Although it is entirely possible that someone from Timbuktu can register a Chicago Poetry domain and start publishing say porn on it, and really there is nothing anybody can do about it.)

Though, sadly, the conduct of the people running the show (at both ends, CJ original remark, and the needless reaction, when it just as easily could have, should have been ignored) does not fill the community with any great degree of confidence.

I will say this CJ runs a valuable site (to find out about Chicago Poetry events). And the second site now, is only a valuable addition to that purpose.